Sunday, 5 July 2020

Another Nick Murray Lemon?




And I too want to add my thanks for the effort and knowledge you have shared with the community. I thank you for your thanks. I did not diagnose root cause with Nick's 991's issues. I didn't directly, or specifically speculate on root causes for Nick's cars. That was never my intention. Certainly, one might, incorrectly, deduce from my posts that I was convinced that aftermarket stuff was the problem. I am not convinced. I wouldn't even offer to bet on the cause without more data. The second question has yet to be answered. The first question sparked a discussion of failure modes due, indirectly, to AS and it was in the context of that discussion that I posted The Tome. I don't know what Nick's 991's issues are. I prefer data before speculating. Before even prioritizing speculation, so as to direct diagnosis tasks, I prefer lots of data. Data are very sparse on the ground here.





Obviously plenty of owners run these items in their cars, but it may be something with the way it has been installed in his car. He had this same setup in his 991.1 which had a lot of issues as well. The contrary is that tons of owners on here have radar detectors and dash cams as well with no issues, so again, I am just speculating. There are tons of cars running around with AS installed and we don't see them dead on the road. I do have the opinion that not all AS installers are equal. This however doesn't lead me to conclude that Nick's problems are due to the AS installs. Did the same installer do both jobs? Would you have approached the installs early on in the diagnosis? As outlined in The Tome a few pages back, I would have let data lead me. If the data point to a location and in that location I find AS stuff, then sure, I'm going to investigate the AS stuff first. If AS stuff gets in the way them I'm going to disconnect, rework, or otherwise get it out of the way.





If the data don't give any clue then - at least on a 928 - you often begin by disconnecting things. AS would likely be at or near the top of that list. As an aside, my track record of ferreting-out ridiculous bugs on 928s has everything to do with available reference material from Porsche, independent publications, and rennlist which I have read, pondered, and put into practice. Obviously, being an engineer by education doesn't hurt, but without insight into the systems I'd just be a monkey with a degree poking pins in a voodoo doll swapping out parts until someone's check book was empty. I'd probably tell the Devil to FO. No point in starting eternity notwithstanding. Why would PCNA NOT want to understand the quality, integrity, and performance of the added electronics, and any impact on the car's many faults? Seems like they often take a hard line on lesser issues (i.e. exploding door cards on 991.1, early, unexplained PDK failures, etc.).





Why not in this case? We could go on forever speculating on the constraints that factor into Porsche's decisions. I have no insight - probably less than others on this thread - into those processes. There's a power hierarchy with customers and dealer technicians at the bottom, PAG on top, with dealerships and PCNA somewhere in the middle. Ultimately the policies and processes are originated at PAG and driven down the hierarchy. Profit is the strongest motivator and we've ample evidence that Porsche knows how to maximize their profit-to-customer-discontent ratio. As for 'added electronics' where do you draw the line? On how much random add-on stuff are you willing to expend your company's resources investigating? I love Nick's videos, and feel he is a Porsche fan, but it seems that Porsche the brand, and the car are getting a bum wrap with some potentially explosive evidence right in front of their eyes. First, I don't see folks running from the room and selling their Porsches.





I doubt Porsche is getting a 'bum wrap' from Nick's (or anyone's) videos any more or any less than any other car maker. I would bet that if one spent time one could pick a car company at random and find, on the internet, very similar stories about that company. Sell a million of anything and you will have some unhappy customers and evidence of same on the internet. Second, this old saying applies: You can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time, but you cant please all of the people all of the time. It is inevitable in the conduct of business that you will run across an entity (person, client, company, organization) that you can't please. This might be because, on one extreme, the entity in question by nature can't ever be pleased, or, on the other extreme, that it would cost far too much money to please that entity. Or do you spend 5% on the 'problem' client and the other 95% on the other 99.999% of your clients. Or do you just buy back the product from your 'problem' client? If that's an option. It's very fair to say you can't answer that question without more details. The devil is in the details. Occam's Razor is the logical principle that the simplest solution is usually correct. It isn't clear to me where Occam cuts in this context. There are several 'simple solutions.' Aftermarket Stuff is one. Some folks in this thread have offered others. And in the end, lightening does sometimes strike twice in the same spot.